Moots RSL Shimano Di2 vs. New SRAM Red

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Moots RSL Shimano Di2 vs. New SRAM Red

16 posts from 9 voices

Started 1 year ago by CTracer
Latest reply from Tiege10

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CTracer
Member

I'm close to pulling the trigger on a new RSL and I need to decide whether to stick with a Di2 drivetrain, which I love, or going with the new SRAM Red to save some weight. I'm currently riding a Parlee Z5 with full Di2 and a Cannondale Si Sl/Quarq crankset. The Parlee is pretty light and I would like the RSL build to be in the same ballpark. The new Red looks compelling but I wonder long-term wether it is better to have a frame that is dedicated to an electronic group (internal wiring) vs. mechanical. Thanks for any thoughts on this dilemma!

CTracer

Posted 1 year ago #
netanimic
Member

Sram Red for me!!!

Posted 1 year ago #
Domestique
Member

Greetings CT,

Your Parlee is similar to what my older brother has, he's got a Z1 with Di2, great bike. Whenever I visit him in VA Beach or when he comes out to Flagstaff I always ask him to bring his bike so I can poach a few rides on it.

My old shop mechanic when I lived in PA rode a Moots PX equipped with SRAM Red and although I thought it was nice I preferred my Campy Record 11 PX. Having said that as much as I like my 'conventional' Record group my next Moots will have either Shimano's Di2 or Campy's upcoming EPS.

As far as your situation is concerned, if it were my choice I'd stick with the Di2, so what if it weighs a little bit more, IMHO the benefits of the electronic shifting far outweighs the small weight penalty. Whichever way you decide to go it's gonna be a fantastic bike, enjoy!

D.

Posted 1 year ago #
29ner
Member

It's not entirely clear if you're keeping and riding both bikes? If so, then I would, personally, go with Di2 over Red - compatible 'things' is the reason for that. I like my bikes to feel the same as far as contact points are concerned and how they shift, brake, lever feel, etc.

That new Red looks really nice, but I wouldn't think twice about it as far as weight - I am much more concerned with fit and feel than a few ounces one way or the other. Again, that's just me - a weight weenie type I am not.

Now, if you're getting rid of the Parlee and Di2, then that is a much tougher call....that new Red is very sweet looking and has been getting rave reviews. I am not entirely sold on the electric stuff - seems like an answer that didn't really have a question. I've ridden the Di2, however, and there is no doubt it's pretty damn nice. Note that Di2 is going to 11 speed. Also, I've read that the new Di2 will have the smaller diameter wiring harness like the Ultegra Di2. I'm assuming you have the Dura-Ace Di2?

So, my answer/suggestion is two fold: (1) if you're keeping the Parlee/Di2 - I'd stick with Di2 and get the Moots made with internal routing, blah, blah. (2) If your getting rid of the Parlee/Di2, I'd go Red as it's lighter, getting rave reviews, has a near flawless track record (except if you ask Andy Schleck), and you won't get stuck 40 miles east of nowhere with a dead battery.

Posted 1 year ago #
CTracer
Member

Thanks for the excellent feedback. Good points made by everyone. If i keep the Parlee I would probably go with Sram but I don't think I can justify 2 "good" bikes. I most likely will transfer my Di2 from the Parlee over to the Moots. Hopefully the RSL Di2 option will work with either the old or future wiring harnesses in case I ever go 11 speed. That's down the road aways, however.

Thanks again!

Posted 1 year ago #
29ner
Member

Oh c'mon - anyone can justify more than one nice bike. I have heard that the new/old Di2 will be very comparable as far as the wiring harness - it's a different connector and smaller diameter wires (I think, anyway). Regardless, it won't change the way Moots (or any other company) will make the frame.

I am no retro-grouch (far from it), but I still can't wrap my head around electric shifting. I suppose if I dedicated myself to it, I would never go back, but again - an answer to a question that wasn't asked, at least in my world. All the high end mechanical stuff works flawlessly, is lighter, is serviceable (for the most part), less expensive, you don't have a battery box interrupting the clean lines of a frame, you can usually 'be on your way' in the advent of a major mal-function, and you don't have to plug-it-in every two weeks. (Maybe I am a retro-grouch). See, I'm not sold on electric cars yet, either.

Those with Di2 will argue, validily, all the positive attributes - so it's a ying-yang thing and you can't go wrong. It'll be sweet regardless of group.

Posted 1 year ago #
CTracer
Member

29er,

I understand where you are coming from (retro) - that's partially why I'm going back to ti from carbon. However, I have been riding my DA7900 equipped travel bike (ti with S&S couplers) lately while I do some maintenance on the Parlee. It confirmed to me that I could never go back to mechanical except for certain applications. Di2 is really that good. There are actually less wires to deal with (and those can be internal) and the battery only needs to be charged around every 2 months depending on usage. You need to try a Di2 equipped bike!

Posted 1 year ago #
29ner
Member

You're spending my money.

Posted 1 year ago #
poff
Member

I actually have Di2 on my S&S coupled moots compact frame. It is very easy to assemble/disassemble with Di2. I am going to have 2 RSLs - one with internal Di2 and one with SR11 mech. I did not like the ergonomics of sram red.

Posted 1 year ago #
CTracer
Member

How did you manage Di2 with the coupled bike?! I was trying to figure out how to "split" the Di2 cable but I had no luck. Ended up selling the group and going worth DA 7900. What a letdown that group is as compared to Di2.

Posted 1 year ago #
poff
Member

I use zipties to tie the cable to the DT and disconnect a single cable at the junction near levers.

Posted 1 year ago #
roadiesean
Member

Tough choice to make !!!!!!!!!!!!
I am a massive fan of Red, although I hate the look of the latest version (I love the old one though, love it, love it, love it !) but am still very tempted to cross over to Di2, in fact thinking seriously about Ultegra Di2 despite it not being top end, DA is just too expensive.

Posted 1 year ago #
Satellite
Member

Ctracer,

Here is a Youtube Video of a S&S Seven W/Di2 it looks pretty easy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7LL1fZXo82M

Satellite

Posted 1 year ago #
CTracer
Member

Thanks poff, Satellite. Ahh, it looks like they spliced a connector inside the DT unless that's the way the internal wiring kit comes. I wish I saw this video before I sold my Di2 group! For a travel bike, a mechanical group makes assembly/disassembly pretty easy and spare parts are easier to obtain if you are on the road but I do miss Di2 when I ride that bike.

BTW, I officially placed my order for the RSL with the Di2 option. Now the wait begins! I may try SRAM Red on my old bike if I decide to keep that frame. I'm not sure I can justify 2 "good" bikes, however. I'm already thinking about a new Cx bike for the fall! This behavior has to stop!

CTracer

Posted 1 year ago #
Jerome
Member

SRAM Red because cycling is simple and must stay like that.

Di2 is not part of innovation.

And what about the enviro could this planet support another few billions of small battery, after the cell phone mania ? Certainly not.

Please resist that trend when it is not absolutely necessary (no need to give away your cell phone won't work with cable). I am sure if Steve Jobs would have been in cycling he would have kept riding cables actuated devices.

Best

Best

jérôme

Posted 1 year ago #
Tiege10
Member

If you want to be a retro grouch, that's fine to each his own. But please lay off the Greenpeace environmental spin that running a Di2 set up with a battery is somehow the end of the environment versus a mechanical shifting system because in reality it is the mechanical system which will put far more refuse into the environment than an electronic battery. The Shimano Di2 battery is speced for a MINIMUM 500 charges, and a typical charge will last between 1200 and 1600 miles. I dont know too many typical cyclists putting in that amount of miles on a weekly or even a biweekly basis. That distance is more than half a Typical Tour De France. Most riders will get close to two months if not more from each charge. Now do the math, two months by 500. Works out to about 90 years, and even if you charge it every month you are still looking at 40 plus years between battery replacements. In addition, the electronic cables themselves essentially NEVER have to be replaced. With a mechanical shifting system youll typically be replacing your metal cables, the ferules and the nice PLASTIC housings and their associated lubricants at least once per season if not many more times per season. A cross racer or bike commuter in the northeast or northwest will be replzcing cables and housings far more than once per season every season. Thats a whole boatload of plastic, lubricants and metals being discarded. Add in the additional environmental costs to manufacture all those constantly replaced mechanical housings and cables and electronic Di2 looks pretty darn environmentally friendly by comparison IMO. I'll gladly trade the harm of replacing a small battery every 40 or 50 years with the deluge of plastic housings and associated crap that mechanical users go through monthly any day. There, that's my own GreenPeace take on it.

By the way, Di2 iMO doesnt not just shift a little bit better than the best mechanical systems, it shifts WAY WAY better. Every shift is spot on once its adjusted, Every Shift. And the front derailleur trim blows away any mechanical system out there, it does, and unlike mechanical systems that have to constantly be fudged with, particularly ones that deal with muddy cross, or rough commuting conditions, Di2 is like a Chris King headset. Its set it and forget it. Get it set up right and you never have to fudge with it again, unless you trash your rear derailleur or der hangar in a crash, etc.

Posted 1 year ago #

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